How To Measure Brain Aging And Lower Dementia Risk Early

Your brain can be drifting in the wrong direction long before you notice a single memory slip, and that’s the scary part of cognitive decline. We sit down with physician-neuroscientist Dr Christin Glorioso, CEO of NeuroAge, to get concrete about brain aging, Alzheimer’s risk, and what prevention actually looks like when you stop relying on vibes and start relying on data. 

We talk about why genetics like APOE4 matter, why they’re not destiny, and how lifestyle still drives a huge part of dementia risk. Dr Christin explains how brain age can be measured using a combination of brain MRI (including shrinkage in key regions like the hippocampus), online cognitive testing, and blood biomarkers that reflect core mechanisms of brain aging like synapse health, mitochondrial function, inflammation, and DNA damage. A big theme is timing: cognition is a lagging indicator, so waiting until you “feel off” often means you’re already late. 

We also get practical about interventions that move the needle. We dig into exercise that supports memory regions (including why HIIT can be uniquely helpful), why VO2 max is an underrated brain-health metric, and how sleep, stress, and community can be the missing links for high performers. Finally, we clear up the lithium conversation: lithium orotate vs lithium carbonate, what the human evidence actually supports, and why supplement stacks and polypharmacy can quietly work against you. 

If you found this useful, subscribe, share it with someone you care about, and leave a review so more people start treating brain health like the center of longevity, not an afterthought.

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Transcript

Welcome And Medical Disclaimer

Speaker 1 0:00

Frame aging is something that you can do something about. It's better to start early because that's going to allow you the best shot at prevention. And I would say, you know, take the bull by the horns, be proactive, just like other aspects of longevity. You know, action is in here.

Why Alzheimer’s Became Personal

Speaker 0:16

This is the Longevity Loop Podcast, and I'm your host, Brett Wallace. In every episode, I bring you the leading voices in longevity, plus my own insights, put the world's best strategies directly into your hands, making elite longevity strategies accessible to everyone, regardless of your background. So let's jump into the loop starting right now. Alright, everyone, welcome to the Longevity Loop podcast. Today we're going to be talking uh about something a lot of people wonder about, and maybe quietly, basically brain aging and is it aging more or faster than we might think? And there's a lot of talk these days, and probably not just these days, but for a long time about dementia and whatever. And I think there's a lot more awareness around these topics nowadays, and it's super relevant to us longevity enthusiasts because obviously who wants a great body at 100 or 80 or whatever the case may be, but a brain that just doesn't work, right? So who we're talking with today is Dr. Glorioso. She runs the amazing newsletter, the Neuro Age new Neuro Age newsletter that I've been subscribed to, well, probably six months even longer. I don't know how long you've actually had that going, but there's a recent addition that really sparked my interest, and this was about the use of lithium. And the lithium is one of those things that I think way back in the day I thought it was a prescription only thing. Like, oh yeah, it's like like I think I had it confused with volume, maybe or something, right? It's just like something that is like, oh, lithium. They're like, oh yeah, that's something that you prescribe. But then I realized it wasn't. Um, I started seeing it in some longevity circles, and then I remembered way back in high school there's the Nirva Nirvana song lithium, so I was like, all right. And then uh probably most recently I saw it in Brian Johnson's kind of crazy stack of a hundred plus supplements. I saw longevity uh lithium nestled in there, and I'm like, wait, people are taking this for brain health, and I that was kind of what kind of re-sparked my curiosity about it. And then, like I mentioned, uh, I saw Dr. Christin uh or Dr. Glorioso's newsletter, and that's when I decided to reach out. So, with that said, uh oh, medical disclaimer I'm not a doctor, um, and this is not medical advice. This is a conversation between two professionals, and we want to have a great conversation today. But anything that is said today isn't anything that's meant to be taken as advice. Check with your doctor first before doing anything, because all this stuff is highly personalized to each individual. So make sure to check with your doctor before taking any action or actions that you might hear today on uh this podcast. So, Dr. Glorioso, with all that rambling preamble, um, what pulled you into brain aging uh and what made this personal for you?

Speaker 1 3:30

Yeah, so so I'm I'm a physician and neuroscientist by training, and uh I wear two hats. So I'm the CEO of a company called NeuroAge. The newsletter is part of that. Um uh we have a test for brain aging. We're trying to help people keep their brain sharp for as long as possible. And I also run a nonprofit called Longevity Global. We have events in more than 30 cities around the world. Um, so I've been in the longevity space for 20 years now, since I started grad school in the early 2000s. Um uh I have an MD and a PhD in neuroscience, and the reason I've basically done everything in my career is my family history of Alzheimer's. So when I was a kid, my grandmother suffered with Alzheimer's for about seven years. My grandfather took care of her in the home. This had a really big impact on the whole family. Um, and then unfortunately, it was in the next generation, and my um aunt, uh her daughter, uh, just recently passed away from Alzheimer's in her 70s, which is quite young. Um, and I myself found out um in the last five years or so through actually testing through my company, um, that I have a genetic risk factor myself. So I have an Apoe4 allele. It's the biggest common risk factor for Alzheimer's. About 20 per 20 to 25% of people have one. Uh that puts people at two to three times the risk. That's what I have. And then 2% of people have two copies of the ApoE4 allele, and that puts them at 10 to 12 times the risk as the average person. And more and more people are finding out about this. And, you know, I'm part of groups. We have many clients that have one or two Apoe4 alleles, and people really want to know what what we can do about this. Um, we sort of see that, you know, this isn't a guarantee you're gonna get Alzheimer's because there's this huge lifestyle component, which I which I can talk about as well. But it does mean that you're playing on hard mode. So if you think about it like a like a video game, you know, um most people are playing on average mode or easy mode with their genetics and people that have one or two Apple E4 alleles, the game is beatable, but it's harder than it is for the average person. And you need to worry more about the lifestyle component.

Speaker 5:51

Got it. And so when you say on hard mode, is it like day-to-day stuff being harder, or is it just something to it's like it's harder to like get to that point where you can kind of overcome that or maybe a combination of both?

Speaker 1 6:03

Yeah, so you have um basically the ApoE for allele, which is this big genetic risk factor that a lot of people have, is a cholesterol transport problem. So um there's a mutation in it in Apoe. It just like many people have heard of Apo B, which is something you test for your heart. Apoe is another Apo. It transports cholesterol in your brain, and that doesn't happen as efficiently in people with ApoE4 allele. So they tend to have higher cholesterol, higher lipids. Um, they also can't process saturated fat as well. So basically, it means that everything you do for longevity in general, with diet, exercise, sleep, um, all of all of those good things, you have to be even more worried about that as someone with an apo E4 allele. So you need to step up your longevity gain in order to to prevent Alzheimer's. And Alzheimer's is about 60% genetic, 40% environment. And there was a paper in the Lancet that showed that up to 65% of cases of Alzheimer's can be prevented just through lifestyle interventions. And that's even for. Yeah.

Speaker 7:16

That's cool to hear. Uh you know, I I hear so much about it, and a lot of times I hear a lot of people was like, well, like it's just it is what it is, you know. I'm just gonna, you know, YOLO, you know, like that type of thing, where where you're like, no, like I I don't uh I don't know the truth about it though, but that's great to hear that for those that do have this SNP, uh, that there is a significant factor to you have control of that. Um and is it this just a normal genetics test to find if you have these SNPs or not?

Speaker 1 7:50

Yeah, so we do whole genome sequencing. 23andMe only tests about 1% of the genome. Neuroage tests um the whole genome, and we test for 40 different genetic variants that contribute to Alzheimer's. So Apple E4 is the biggest one that contributes, but there's 39 other ones also that contribute. And then we uh create a weighted average so we can tell you your risk at every age of having Alzheimer's, it goes up exponentially with age based on your genetics alone. So it's really comprehensive genetic testing. And then we also test for rare variants. So um some people have rare familial forms of the disease, those are harder to treat with lifestyle interventions, and they happen earlier on. So, like my family, Alzheimer's happened pretty early, late 60s and 70s. And so I was actually wondering if we had one of these rare variants, but so far it looks like we don't. Um, but I we test for those as well in case people are wondering. Um you know, genetic risk.

APOE4 And What “Hard Mode” Means

Speaker 8:53

Okay, that's cool. That's really, really cool. I had no idea that you guys sequence the whole genome like that. That's a really powerful thing. Um so what might not I like when it comes to someone that's healthy, you know, or they assume they're healthy, what might they not understand about Alzheimer's and uh, you know, and until they've seen it up close, you know, because I feel like it's also one of those things, I mean, just like so many medical technicians, you kind of forget about it, it's like, oh, that's not gonna happen to me until it happens to someone close to you, or even yourself, you know, and then you're like, oh, I really need to do something about that. So what might be people missing when they're healthy or not really under fully understand about it uh until they're faced with it like that?

Speaker 1 9:38

I think there's a few things. Um one is that it your brain is aging even starting in your 20s. So peop you start um, you know, your reaction time slows down, you start um not being able to remember as many names and faces, you start this aging process, your brain is shrinking um as as you get older due to loss of neurons and loss of connections between neurons. And it's really the rate at which that's happening that's determining who's gonna get Alzheimer's and who's not. So it's a problem that is slow moving and starting even in early adulthood. So the other thing is, you know, having early intervention is really key. You need decades to work on this problem from a lifestyle perspective. So, you know, knowing where you are in your 30s and 40s helps you see whether what you're doing is actually working. Um, so those are the two things. And and I guess the the last thing is a lot of people, as you mentioned, think there's nothing you can do about it, and that's absolutely not true. So there's this huge actionable piece.

Speaker 10:43

So when you start on this early, say you get your genome sequenced and you're like, okay, I've got these risks involved. You're saying, so you're a healthy 30-year-old. The lifestyle innovations that you would give to them, how would they know if they're working or not? You just said, you know, like you can kind of track this. How how do you track that? Is it cholesterol levels that you're looking at, or or what other markers would you be looking at to know that you're on the right track doing the right thing as much as humanly possible?

Speaker 1 11:17

So we offer um a test for brain aging. And what my previous research out of MIT showed is that if you can be five years younger in your biological brain age than your chronological age, you're six times less likely to have Alzheimer's in the future. And you can mitigate your genetic risk entirely, at least for the common SNPs. For the more rare forms, uh, that's harder. But for the type of Alzheimer's most people end up being diagnosed with, um, you this five years actually will work. So there's this huge actual piece. And the way we test for how old your brain is, is we combine brain MRI, so the volume of your brain, how fast it's shrinking, with cognitive testing. So we have five cognitive tests online. They're called neurogames, they're really well clinically validated in hundreds of thousands of people by many researchers. Um, reaction time is one of those tests. Names and faces is another. That also was one I was worried about. Am I forgetting more names and faces than I used to? Um a digit span, so that's how many numbers can you remember in a row? So the average adult can remember seven digits. That's part of why uh phone numbers are seven digits long. By the time you're in your 80s, the average person can only remember four. So that's another one. Um, and uh and then we do uh a game called Focus just to make sure that people um don't have ADHD or problems with attention that are influencing their scores. Um, so that's the testing that we do for cognition that will give you an age just based on that testing. I think we're the only people giving people an age based on these cognitive um scores. And then the last part is blood biomarkers. So we have a brain aging clock. Um, so we can track what's happening in your brain from blood levels of 52 RNA transcripts. Um and those track with how many synapses you have, mitochondria, DNA damage, all of the hallmarks of brain aging. And we combine those together using AI, and we give you a brain age. And that five years younger is one standard deviation. So if you think back to the bell curve in school, that's like getting a B in brain aging. So it's um very doable. Uh you don't have to be, you know, a hundred percent. You don't have to kill yourself and do everything right. You just have to be significantly above average and how you're doing with your brain aging. And so yeah.

Speaker 13:49

So it sounds Yeah, go ahead. So it sounds like the the combination of those three things is like what you kind of get that total age, right? So those inputs from the MRI scan, so your brain size, which I imagine does that correlate to like kind of blood flow, or is it kind of like a veins where you know, like veins as they age, they get more brittle and kind of small? Is is that kind of how the brain MRI health would work as far as like a big, juicy, healthy brain, so to speak? Would that be like, you know, the picture of health? But it like when a brain shrinks, what's happening there?

How Brain Age Testing Works

Speaker 1 14:21

Yeah, so I think of neurons like trees. So like a really healthy tree, young tree will be very bushy, will have lots of leaves, lots of lots of branches. And so if you think of a neuron, it has the cell body, and then those branches are like the synapses and connections between neurons. So there's two things that happen as you age. One is that the branches get more scraggly. So you have an older looking tree that has less leaves and has less branching, and that causes the brain to shrink. And the other thing that happens is actually neurons die. So um this happens normally. So it in a part of the brain called the substantia nigra, which is the Parkinson's area of the brain, has uh dopamine neurons. And uh every decade people lose five to ten percent of their dopamine neurons, just normally with aging. Um, but it's not until you lose 70% of them that you start to develop Parkinson's disease. And it's really the rate at which that happens that determines who gets Parkinson's and who doesn't. And so brain volume is is uh a way of uh, you know, one-on-one approximating how many neurons you have. So the more neurons you have, the more volume you're gonna have. So that's why structural MRI is such a good um predictor of brain aging.

Speaker 15:39

And is there ways to slow down that neuron loss so you you don't have that decline moving so fast? I imagine no matter what you do, you're gonna be, you know, just kind of moving in that direction, just like age in general. But it's it sounds like, you know, just from uh, you know, you can change the loss of those neurons.

Speaker 1 16:00

Absolutely. Yeah. I mean it's the same, same thing as muscle mass, right? You lose muscle mass with age, you can track the rate of that decline, you can do things to combat it. So what's remarkable is that there are randomized control trials to show that with just extra 25 extra minutes of exercise a week, so people are able to grow their brains back on MRI. So you can see this increase in volume. So the area that I care about the most is um hippocampus, because that's the Alzheimer's area that's stores short-term memory and shrinks with Alzheimer's disease. Um, normally you lose a little over 1% of your hippocampus every year. And um actually my hippocampus got one and a half percent bigger in the last year and a half. So you can actually have this, which is pretty pretty amazing, right? So um, and and the best so different brain areas respond to different interventions that we've seen. Hippocampus responds best to high intensity interval training. I know that's not what people want to hear because it's you know, Narid is full by floor, and sprinting is not everyone's favorite task to do, but that is how you increase the volume of your hippocampus.

Speaker 17:14

Um okay, that's great to know. Yeah, because I guess that would be my follow-up question. Is it like kind of the zone two type of training that we hear a lot, or is it high intensity? And you just answered it. Yeah, we I was just having a discussion with a doctor friend. It's like, what would you rather do like every day, you know, with like a cold plunge or Norwegian four by four? It's quite the discussion. You know, that we're just like, oh man, they both suck. What would you s what would you say the minimum effective dose of intervals are? Is it is that a once a week thing, or is that just as much as you can stand, or what's what's the something that would be something that would be a tangible, like, okay, I really hate to do this, but okay, Mondays is my day, or or something to that extent.

Speaker 1 17:55

Yes, I would say one to two times a a week is sufficient. And the good news is that if you do that for six months, you're protected for five years. So you can just do six months of training one to two times a week, and then it's good for five years. So that's what we've seen in these randomized control trials for dementia prevention. And another really good related thing to track is VO2 max. That's like your um body's engine, how efficient it is at using oxygen. And as you do the neuro region four by four, or you can do other things like you can do it on a bike, you can do intervals on a bike, or do stairs, you know, anything that's getting your heart rate up to 70, 80 percent of max for at least 30 second intervals works. And then you can see that you're improving your VO2 max. So um VO2 max is a really good indicator of dementia risk as well, independently.

Speaker 18:48

Yeah, I'm a cyclist, and so a lot of the trainings I do, you know, when when it when working with a coach, you know, is like doing those, you know, repeat intervals. And then for those of you who don't know what a Norwegian 4x4 is, um, is four minutes max effort four times with four minutes of rest in between. So it's a fairly short workout, but it's just it's utterly um, yeah, you feel really good when it's done. Let's put it that way. Um, and then uh yeah, like you said, the the stairs. Um I feel like I have friends that do them on those aerodyne bikes. Um, but yeah, just any way that you can get some like kind of maximal efforts are the way to do that. Uh and so I'm gonna ask you a question, and this is probably a very ignorant question. I don't know, but how are Parkinson's, I mean, I know it's all brain related, but like uh dementia, right? A lot of people talk about dementia, uh Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, like you mentioned. How are they how are they all related? I mean, it's it's obviously not the same thing, but I feel like the more I talk to you and have you know, I'm just thinking I'm here is like, how are these things related? I mean, it's all brain health, but what are the similarities to them and are they the same genetic risk types or SNPs, or like how are they all related or or not at all?

Exercise That Grows Key Brain Regions

Speaker 1 20:09

This is a great question, actually. And I start off most of my lectures uh answering this exact question because I get it so often. So dementia is um actually an umbrella term, and there's maybe about a dozen different types of dementia. So there's Alzheimer's dementia, Parkinson's dementia, frontotemporal dementia, vascular dementia, uh dementia with Lewy bodies. So there's all these different types. And dementia just means you are having memory problems, age-related neurodegenerative memory problems, and there's a bunch of different disorders within that. So, how are they different? Um, so they have some overlapping features. So it gets even more confusing because there's mixed dementias, which means you're the combination of a bunch of them, and often if people have one, they will have another. That's probably because age is a huge risk factor for all of these. So you're getting accelerated aging in the brain. But in general, I would say that they affect different parts of the brain. And we can actually see this on MRI even in healthy people as they age, what they might be more at risk for. So if the hippocampus is shrinking, that is Alzheimer's risk. If the fronto and temporal regions, so the front and side regions of the brain are shrinking, that is frontotemporal dementia. Um, if the substantia nigra is shrinking, which is a region kind of back in here, uh, that is a risk for Parkinson's disease. There's some other Parkinson's areas, caught eight and putamin as well. So you can tell what diseases people are at risk for by which part of the brain is shrinking. Um ALS is a loss of neurons in the spinal cord. So it's neuron loss in different parts of the brain. Now, why is that those neurons being lost in different parts of the brain? They have somewhat different genetics and somewhat, although even then there's some common genetics between them, which makes it a little confusing. Um But uh they have somewhat different genetic causes and they have somewhat different uh toxic proteins that build up. So in Alzheimer's, you see amyloid and tau. There's even a blood test that can test your amyloid and tau now. In um what's known as senucleinopathies, uh, that's alpha senuclein that's building, building up. So there's different aggregations. So proteins are becoming sticky and clumping together, and that's causing the neurons to die, or perhaps it's a consequence of the neurons dying. We're not really sure, cause for consequence there, but you see different proteins that are clumping together that are related to that neuron loss.

Speaker 22:44

Got it. I I remember that study that they're talking about the amyloid plaque, and then that was debunked or something. Do you like what there's like like a couple years ago, right? Like where there's some kind of landmark study where, like, hey, we figured this out, and then it came out that it actually wasn't as figured out as once was thought. What was what was that about?

Dementia Types And What Shrinks

Speaker 1 23:05

That's a super interesting story. It's sort of like science drama. Um I I can tell you that story because it's one that's really fascinating. So um in the early 1900s, the first Alzheimer's patient was identified. Um, the doctor that discovered Alzheimer's was named Aloise Alzheimer, that's why it's called Alzheimer's. And he had this patient, and in her 50s, even she started to have memory problems and all the classic signs of Alzheimer's. And then when she died, they um did an autopsy, looked in her brain, and they saw amyloid plaques. And at that time, they, you know, cause and consequence wasn't, you know, criteria for establishing causation wasn't really known. So they said, this must be what's happening. It must be, we see these weird protein plaques building up in her brain. This must be what's causing Alzheimer's. Um, so that was how the disease was even defined. So for a long time, the only way you had a disease diagnosis of Alzheimer's was after you died. They would look in your brain and confirm that you had these plaques. Now, in the early 2000s, we started to get new tools that allowed us to understand things better. One of those tools was PET scan. So now they could image amyloid plaques in living people. And they noticed something, which is that there are many people with lots of amyloid plaques with no Alzheimer's, and their memory was fine. So if amyloid was the sole cause of Alzheimer's disease, you would not, you would expect anyone that has these plaques to have memory problems to have Alzheimer's. And that wasn't true. So that was the first issue. Um, at the same time in the late 90s, early 2000s, all these drug, big drug companies started making anti-amyloid drugs, antibodies that could remove these amyloid plaques. We actually have a couple of them approved now. Um and so the thought was, okay, we'll just remove the amyloid plaques, and then that will cure Alzheimer's disease. Did not turn out to be entirely true. There was a whole bunch of drug failures. And then at the same time, the president of Stanford stepped down because there were doctored images and papers. So there was falsified data. A bunch of big landmark papers that were looking at amyloid and mice were retracted. Um, that doesn't necessarily mean the story is wrong, but it does mean a lot of the pieces that brought it to where it is were falsified. Um and then, you know, I for 15 years was in the camp of this is all BS. Um, the papers are retracted, the drugs don't work, um, you know, people have amyloid that don't have Alzheimer's, this is just a complete red herring, we're barking up the wrong tree, and I can't believe we've wasted billions of dollars as a society on pursuing these drugs. Until the last couple of years, when a couple of drugs are approved, and it turns out the drugs do kind of work. They don't work well and they have bad side effects. But for about half of people, if they're caught early enough, it will stop Alzheimer's in its tracks to remove these plaques. So they're a part of the story. The drugs don't work for everybody, and they work much better earlier on in the course of disease. Another reason to get your diagnosis and start working on this early, because if you do want to use those drugs, you the earlier you start the better. Um, and so now how I think about it is that uh plaque plaques that build up that are made of amyloid are similar to plaques that build up in your arteries. So cholesterol is not the cause of heart disease, it's one risk factor amongst many. And so I think the same way we should be thinking about these amyloid plaques. Amyloid is one risk factor amongst many. And if you have high amounts of amyloid, you're at higher risk, and removing it is probably going to decrease your risk, but there's a bunch of other things contributing as well. Aging and all of the hallmarks of aging being the biggest other thing. So mitochondrial dysfunction, synapse loss, DNA damage, all of inflammation, all the things that are happening in your brain that are creating the environment that causes neurons to die.

Speaker 27:23

Got it. Okay. Well, that's I mean, that's good to know that it's it's they do work. There are some solutions, but it's also not the whole picture as seemingly does or proposed or what was said is like, hey, these are the miracle cure all, et cetera. And it sounds like they can still be effective with a certain segment of the population, but not as effective as what once was thought, and then there's all the other things um, you know, that goes into it. And it just sounds like it's like so many things with longevity, it's just like, okay, it's part of this puzzle. Yes, you want to put it here, but then you gotta pay attention to everything else to also make it um, you know, make everything click together. Um thanks for that breakdown. Yeah, that was one of those things where it's just like, man, the you know, it's like it's one of those things that makes it so hard to like, okay, these scientific papers come out and you're like, wow, this is really interesting, and then something like that comes out where it's like, actually, that was all and it you really put it nicely, where it's like some of the research was really good. It was just that they're making extrapolations to the end, which wasn't correct, to get a result. You know, uh there's a little bit of you know, uh good and truth to what they're doing, but also not to the extent that they were were claiming theirs. One thing that I'm always curious about, so if I feel really mentally sharp, or if someone feels mentally sharp, can you still have a brain that is aging faster or or too fast? I mean, is it something that you'll actually feel in your brain that means that your brain is older than you are, or are those kind of correlated like what you're feeling? Obviously, there'd be like very, very small effects, it sounds like, but can you just feel still like, hey, I still got my memory? I can remember 10 numbers, you know, and all these things, but to still actually have a brain that that is aging faster than than it should be.

Speaker 1 29:26

Yes, and that's why it's important to do each piece of the testing, because um cognition is what's known as a lagging indicator, so it is the last thing to go. So you're gonna have structural changes, like your brain is gonna be shrinking faster than it should be, that you're not on a good path, or you have white matter hyperintensities, which are little cardiovascular changes in the brain. Um, or your blood biomarkers show that you're starting to build up amyloid intel in your 40s or 50s, right? And those can be happening before you have any problems with cognition. Cognition changes last. It's like 10 years before you'll really notice it about 10 years before the onset of disease.

Speaker 30:08

Got it. So it sounds like probably those blood tests, that kind of third component of your testing would be the one that's like catching these things of like, hey, you're these are elevated. This is some probably something to take a look at. So you'd be able to catch that with your testing in that like kind of third part of it with the blood tests and and all of that, correct?

Speaker 1 30:28

Yeah, and you'll see uh you'll see it on cognitive testing as well. It's just not, it won't be something that you'll notice. Maybe your reaction time will be, you know, a few milliseconds slower, but maybe you're not gonna notice that, right? Um and then a lot of people are worried about cognitive things that actually aren't and aren't as much of an issue as they think. So we also get that sort of people being afraid of stuff. I know I am a busy entrepreneur, so I meet tons and tons of people, and sometimes I forget people's names. And for a while I was very worried about that because but it's it's actually more of a feature than a bug as you're you know, as you you're humans are not meant to remember thousands of people. So, you know, there's stuff like that, or misplacing your keys, a lot of times that's just like distraction, right? That's not a real red flag. So a lot of times people are, especially if they have a family history like me, are overly worried. So sometimes doing the cognitive testing can reassure you as well.

Speaker 31:28

Just to make sure you're on the right track. Are are there any other early warning signs that people might miss? I mean, if they're not doing these cognition tests or something, are there something you know, other than the things you might be worried about, like forgetting, you know, if you have got a busy life and a busy busy schedule of forgetting things, or like, oh shoot, I left the milk in the car, or something like that. Um are there other warning signs that people might be having that might be a little bit harder to spot or just missing as far as I mean, I don't know what it would be, but are there other little signs or symptoms that you might get in your life that might just be a little red flag is like, hey, maybe you should check into this?

Speaker 1 32:09

Um, so we know that loss of smell is one of the earliest signs. Um that can but you know, it's also happens with COVID, so don't get mixed up with that. But um, and then there's a reason it happens with COVID because it was damaging the neurons of the nose, right? So um, so but if you have loss of smell, that can be one of the earliest warning signs. Um, you know, uh people not being able to plan, so executive planning. So if someone used to be able to balance their checkbook and now they're having trouble or trouble planning a trip, they used to be able to book flights. So some of the planning kind of stuff is one of the first things that especially family members will will notice. Like mom used to be the planner of the European vacation, and now she is unable to to do that right in the same way that she used to.

Amyloid Plaques And Drug Reality

Speaker 33:02

Got it. Okay, those are like really good to like think about. Like, because the I I feel like it's so hard, like in my, you know, I spend a lot of time working with longevity clinics through my work at longevity clinic marketing, and a lot of the things like when I try to encourage my friends, like, hey, keep your primary care physician, but go uh, you know, check out a specialist. You know, these these people are really giving high-end personalized epigenetic type medicines, but it's always good to like have these like little things that you can remember because it's it's I mean, I'm sure you experience it too. It's really hard to get, you know, friends, family, you know, whoever you talk to in your day-to-day life is like try to push them towards you know getting more testing and whatever, because A, it's expensive, especially in the healthcare system that we have in in America at least today. And and and and it just, I don't know, it's just that's like kind of the bummer thing about longevity in general, right? Is that people are waiting to the last minute till they actually see a symptom, and it's like getting these preliminary things like cognition tests or an MRI scan or blood work that's just kind of goes beyond your basic panels. It's really hard to, you know, convince or try to share how important it is with people, you know, often until it's too late, you know, even with cancer screening, you know, it's like people just don't get these screenings, and then all of a sudden it's like, oh wow, I've got a cancer. And it's like, well, you've probably had it for years, and this would have been prevented with the screening there. Um, so it's just that's why I always like to know, like, okay, like you're losing your planning function. Okay, then that might be a little bit of a red flag to go, you know, investigate more. So so like I just like I just mentioned there, I I spend a lot of time with clinicians, right, and longevity doctors and longevity clinics through uh my other work here. And I I feel, you know, just what we briefly discussed before we started press to record on here is that I feel brain health is something that feels so under-discussed and underrepresented. Then it and maybe it's because people are going into these clinics and like, hey, I feel like I'm just, you know, I'm I'm dragging energy-wise, or maybe it's my hormones or my body composition or or sleep and all these things get so much attention, I feel. Whereas like the mental part of it, the the brain health part of it, it's just I feel like it's just sorely overlooked. Or it's always like a third, fourth, fifth order thing that they're gonna be checking into, you know, hooking up to like a I guess an EEG, right? Would that be like one of the things that someone could is that part of uh like a brain scanning system, the EEGs?

Speaker 1 35:44

Yeah, there's more and more EEG. There's more and more EEG companies that um are around. Um, so people are using EEGs in in clinic. So I've seen that. That's not part of currently part of our testing, although we are interested in it um going forward. Yeah. Okay. But um, you know, I think there's a bunch of reasons why people uh aren't doing the brain age testing right now, right? It's they think there's nothing they can do about it. They go to see a neurologist and they say, You don't have a diagnosis, get out of here, right? Like we can't treat you unless you have a diagnosis. Uh and you know, also people just don't know what to do. They don't know that there's things they can do. So there's like a lot of um information that needs to be shared with people, which is why it's good to be on a podcast like yours, uh kind of letting people know, oh, there there is things that you can do about this.

Speaker 36:37

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's that's the reason I do it is to have like awesome people like yourself that actually know what they're talking about when they're it's just like because me is like I'll just read articles, I'm like, hey, I I guess omega 3s are great. And you know, it's like so pop start popping omega 3s, and you know, but then you know, talking to someone like you that like, hey, there's a system to really figure out what's going on here, and it's X, Y, Z, you know, it's like come check us out at the clinic, and or these are the things you should be. I mean, actually, that's that's another question there. Like, if someone doesn't have access to your services, I because you're you're just on I mean, you're just in person. Are you brick and mortar where you have to go in, or can they get testing through uh like online or or like a Zoom or something like that?

Speaker 1 37:27

Available in about half of the US states and in Canada and in the UK. Um, so we're direct-to-consumer and also selling through longevity clinics. Um and we're partnered with more than 300 MRI clinics. So we send people locally for MRIs, and then the blood testing is a kit at home and the cognitive testing is online. So most people can access our testing.

Speaker 37:52

Great. Yeah, because that would be my next my question that I was leading to is it's like if they can't or don't have access to the newer age services, what should they be asking their doctor, whether it's uh a primary care physician or if they're specialized in medicine? But I I feel like I don't know, I like I'd know like to know your thoughts on this. If someone is going into their primary care physician, I feel like most of them aren't equipped. And if you're not showing a symptom, you know, like you said, to get diagnosed to get sent to a neuro neurologist, then you're just like kind of SOL, right? You're just like sitting there and like, well, I'd like to get tested for this, it's preventative, it's you know, even like a story like yourself where it's like a family history of it, so like it's likely coming down if you don't know for sure. But how are you gonna get the testing or be able to approach this with your physician to you know get to that? Or is it something that someone's just gonna have to hear this podcast or come across your newsletter or see you speak to go to your website to order it? Like, what should be people asking if they don't necessarily have that option to reach out to you?

Early Signs People Miss

Speaker 1 39:07

So people are having memory problems. So even if they're just subjective, even if you're like you just think to yourself like I did, you know, um, am I forgetting more names and faces, or am I losing things more often, or am having some memory issues? It's worth talking to your primary care physician um, regardless, because there are some reversible causes of memory issues that are really better treated early. So things like thyroid problems or B vitamin deficiencies, um, so those can all, or normal pressure hydrocephalus, which is like the brain's plumbing system, gets enlarged. We see this all the time on brain scans. Um, so if you have those um complaints, then it may be as simple as replacing a vitamin that you're deficient in or giving you synthroid, like replacing your thyroid hormone. And if you have normal pressure hydrocephalus, that's something that would need to be drained because that can actually lead to Alzheimer's if it's left untreated. So I would say don't be afraid of those memory problems, get out in front of them and definitely try to rule out all of the normal things that a primary care doc would do when you're complaining about the memory problems. But um, you know, and then if it you know turns out none of those are true, or you treat those things and you're still feeling a little foggy, um, for women, uh, a big cause of brain fog is perimenopause. So, really considering hormone replacement therapy, that's changed my life. I'm just turned 45 and it fixed my sleep. So that's another thing I would suggest that people look into. And then I would just say, you know, do some form of cognitive testing to see where you're at. Doesn't have to be neural age testing, but do do some cognitive testing that you find online to kind of just get an idea of how you're doing a ballpark. And then you can yeah.

Speaker 41:00

Oh, I was just gonna say, I was just gonna comment like, yeah, like perimetopause is a big conversation in our house right now, and we've been, you know, talking about a lot of things with and some of them uh are are creatine, right? Because creatine is also a brain um health thing. Like I feel like there's so much information coming on that, and how that supplement or supplementing with creatine really helps uh with perimenopause. I mean, it seems to help everyone across the board as far as the research that I've been seeing, but um but yeah, that the hormone part of it is also a very important thing, you know. That I feel like that got such a bad rap for so many years, and now it's just kind of coming into like, hey, actually it's a really good thing, you know. There's like let's check this out and and investigate. And you know, it's it's cool to hear success stories, do even just like what you said is like, oh my god, that fixed so many things, you know. So what can you know, people in this space like I consider you know, like myself and a lot a lot of the listeners here longevity enthusiasts, right? Uh what can we still get wrong? Because I feel like we're kind of a little bit more educated than the average uh household say. What can what are we still getting wrong? You know, even if we're doing the testing and and kind of taking the steps and watching our diet and doing our Norwegian four by fours and all that stuff. Um what do you see as is common in like someone that like you know is a little bit more educated in this space? What are they doing wrong? And is is there something that they could do with that information, say in the next 30 days that would like really genuinely help them um, you know, move the needle in this aspect?

Speaker 1 42:41

Yeah, so there are there are nine pillars of healthy brain aging. And those are diet, Mediterranean diet exercise, six times a week, a variety of exercises, sleep, seven to nine hours, community, so loneliness is a big problem. Um, mental activity, so that's either through your job or hobbies, stress management, um, general health, so that's making sure your um cardiovascular and metabolic health, all your numbers are right where they need to be, mental health, so depression and anxiety can lead to accelerated brain aging through cortisol pathways, and then environmental factors. So that's you know, filtering your water, making sure you're not exposed to pesticides or microplastics, removing all the plastic tupperware in your house. And um I can tell you that the ones that are um most problematic for our customers. Um sorry, I think I lost the screen here. How do I get that back? The screen for I'm back. I got it. Sorry, cut that out.

Speaker 43:50

I can see and hear you just fine.

Speaker 1 43:52

Okay, I lost it. Um So, our neuroage customers, we tend to have a lot of high-powered longevity customers, early adopters, biohackers, executives. And there's something that I call the executive phenotype. So they're doing very well in diet, doing very well in exercise, mental activity, check, check, check. Highly motivated people. Sleep and stress, terrible. So we see this all the time. People are not sleeping and they're stressed out. And that is really bad for your brain. So people can be doing everything right. And if they're not working on those two pieces, um, that can cause problems for brain aging. And unfortunately, a lot of people's natural tendency who tend to want to get stuff done, be high powered. Actually, we have to tell them slow down, meditate, do less, time manage, relax. So this is very hard for a lot of people.

The Nine Pillars Of Brain Aging

Speaker 44:56

Yeah, that makes sense. Well, that is a perfect like kind of segue into the use of lithium. So this is like I mentioned in the beginning, this is kind of what put this is the thing that first put you on my radar here with with with the newsletter. And for someone listening right now about lithium, maybe for the first time, uh, or just learning about it, you know, you're probably not hearing about lithium for the first time, but maybe learning about what it does for the first time. What's the strongest case for it and what does it actually do uh to a brain and to help and and again, this I don't know if this is true or not, maybe it's just my imagination, but you're just talking about the executives, you know, the sleep and stress part where I feel like the lithium part, at least since I've taken it, I feel like I kind of have a more e a base, a different mental baseline for with my anxiety. Um, but again, maybe that's just pure um what's the effect that you take and it's not doing anything, you know, placebo effect. You know, is it is it that or like what is lithium and what does it do?

Speaker 1 46:06

So um a lot of psychiatric medi medicines were found by accident. So lithium was origin originally found from um lithium salt salt baths, so like hot springs. Um and what people notice is that people that were in hot hot springs had less um depression, they have less mania. And so for a long time, lithium, high dose lithium uh carbonate. So there's two different types of lithium, which is important in this conversation. So the the kind that treats bipolar disorder, lithium carbonate, um, is uh it's increases BDNF in the brain. We know that's from animal studies, um not from people studies. Um, and it also is uh is analogous to um it sits right next to sodium on the periodic table of the elements. So if you remember from high school chemistry class, there's a periodic table of the elements. Lithium and sodium are next door neighbors on that chart, and so they have a lot of similar properties. And the reason that that's important is because the way your neurons fire in the brain is a chemical reaction of sodium and potassium. So sodium and potassium go in and out of the neurons, they cause firing, um, and that's how your brain actually creates electrical currents. Um, and lithium um can act like sodium but block its functions. So one of the ways lithium works is by um blocking neuronal firing. So if you think if you're too manic or too depressed, you are gonna want to block that firing because your brain is basically overactive emotionally in both directions. So that's how lithium works, at least lithium carbonate for um bipolar disorder. Now, what most of the longevity enthusiasts are taking is lithium oritate, which is a different version of lithium, and um at much lower doses, so more than 10x lower concentrations. So the thinking is that um that uh dosage won't have uh as big of an effect on firing because for people with bipolar disorder, actually, they have a lot of cognitive side effects. They're foggier, they're having trouble thinking because it's shutting down firing, not just of the parts of the brain involved with the motion, but also cognitive processing and thinking. The reason that lithium has come on everyone's radar is a paper out of Harvard from Bruce Yankner's lab last year, where they looked at people's brains who had Alzheimer's and people's brains that had did not have Alzheimer's post-mortem, and they showed the people without Alzheimer's had less lithium. And then in mice, they gave the mice lithium carbonate and lithium orotate separately, and they showed just the lithium orotate was able to reduce the Alzheimer's symptoms in these mice and reduce the pathology in the brain. And so the thinking was that that was evidence, sort of like early evidence, that lithium orotate may be helpful for cognition and helpful in Alzheimer's disease. Now, all of the clinical trials that have been run that have shown some cognitive benefit, thorough trials run on lithium carbonate. So there's a little bit of a discrepancy because the mouse, the good mouse study was with lithium orotate. What people are taking in longevity is lithium oritate, but all of the clinical trials have been run on lithium carbonate. So I don't know that you can it's kind of comparing apples and oranges there to make inferences about human cognition from a different drug at a different concentration. So that is why I and Bruce Yankner himself and uh have been saying that we don't actually recommend that because there aren't clinical trials on microdosing of lithium oritate that show that there's a any benefit in cognition. And historically, 99% of Alzheimer's drugs fail, even if they have good animal data. So, you know, that's a 99% chance that this thing that worked in mice is not gonna work in people once we have the data.

Speaker 50:19

Got it. So it sounds like people are maybe getting these two confused of the difference between the orotate and the carbonate. So they're looking at just just thinking lithium is lithium any old way and being like, great, let's let's take some lithium oritate. So it sounds like what you're coming from is that you're you shouldn't be recommending it, or at least until there's a little bit more research in humans or there's some more evidence based on the oratate, because it's all the studies have been on the carbonate.

Speaker 1 50:52

Right, exactly. And carbonate uh and carbonate didn't work in that mouse study that Bruce Yankner ran, even. So people are kidd um like thinking lithium is lithium, and they're combining the two sets of studies together. Um and uh and making inferences about okay, lithium carbonate showed some cognitive benefits, and then in mice, lithium orotate work to treat Alzheimer's. Therefore, this is the right thing when they're actually two different sets of drugs at two different um concentrations. And so, yes, Bruce Yankner says he's about he's going to run a clinical trial with lithium orotate at the doses that people are currently taking. So, what I would recommend is that people wait for the results of that clinical trial.

Lithium For Brain Health Explained

Speaker 51:41

Okay, that's really good information because I absolutely take lithium orotate at uh I think uh a thousand micrograms, so which is one milligram uh a day. Um, and again, it's probably maybe it's placebo, that's what I feel like. Or or maybe it's something else in my stack, you know, like theanine or something. But yeah, so that that's great information. It's something that's really good to hear that it's like it's probably not, but you know, again, we need more clinical trials, more evidence that it does actually do what everyone is doing, and you know, like and it sounds like people got really excited about that mouse study and started execute. I mean, which is I I feel like this happens with so many uh, you know, molecules and and supplements and minerals that you know it gets this like this thing, and then someone starts doing it, like uh, let's start doing it. Um is there a downside to taking lithium as far as say if I continue to do it just because well, I have got the pills and it's cheap and maybe it's hedging my bets, or is is there a downside to it as far as taking this and maybe there are some side effects or some downstream effects that I might not be aware now, or someone taking it might not be aware about?

Speaker 1 52:55

I mean, at least with lithium carbonate, which is what we have the most data on, we know that it stops firing. So if I was looking for something that's a that's a nootropic that's gonna be good for cognition, I wouldn't want to take a drug that stops firing. That's um not gonna make you sharper. So that's the biggest thing I would say is just the mechanism of action doesn't, in my mind, is not adding up to the type of drug that you would want to be taking. Um, the other big risk is polypharmacy. So a lot of longevity enthusiasts are are taking 30, 50 supplements. I was at a dinner in in Silicon Valley the other day, and the whole table was saying they take 50 plus pills a day. And you know, the thing is like you don't know how those interact with each other, even if on their own they're each individually safe. Um, having there are known drug-drug interactions. You know, one drug is blocking this receptor and upregulating that, and that's causing too much of this other thing. And you can't possibly understand what the combination of all those things are doing. So, you know, what I and I and we see this with neuroage customers that are sort of like overdoing it and a lot of senses, and one thing they're overdoing is taking too many things at the same time that we don't understand how they're working, and then they're not on a good trajectory in terms of their brain aging. We can see it, even though they exercise, they sleep, they have a great diet. And so which of those is the problem? It's really hard to figure it out. So normally what I recommend to people to do is even if you don't do any of that stuff, if you're um if you have the basics really well dialed in, you should be on a good trajectory. And then, and those basics are, you know, all the lifestyle stuff plus making sure your glucose and your lipids and your blood pressure and everything is perfectly dialed in and you're not deficient in anything vitamin-wise. Um, and then from there, add one thing back at a time. So one experiment at a time, and then see what happens. And if you're young enough, like you and I both are, you know, you've got decades to kind of figure this out, and then you can see if something is, you know, making things worse or making things better.

Speaker 55:10

Got it. Yeah, that's some pretty wise the the the eliminating it all and then just adding it and just saying, okay, how do I feel now? How do I feel now? Let's go a little bit more. Um, if you were to recommend one supplement that's just something that you'd recommend to most people for their brain health, what would it be?

Speaker 1 55:27

Yeah, so um I would do I I would do a a comprehensive panel, like a function health, and then um or superpower. I don't I'm not playing friends here, you know, whatever comprehensive biomarker test you want to do, and and then just make sure that you're not deficient in anything. So if you are deficient in B vitamins or vitamin D or anything like that, I would definitely say start there, add back the things that you're deficient in. Too much is bad though, with even with vitamin D and vitamin B, they're U-shaped curves, so you don't want to overdo it. So I wouldn't just have anyone supplement those test first. Um, and then omega-3 is a huge one. Um, if you can get it from your diet, great. That's you know, a piece of fish this big three or four times a week. Um, salmon is better. Um, it's better to get it from diet, but if you can't get it from diet, um a high quality supplement I think is really important.

Speaker 56:27

Yeah, I feel like with seafood, it's uh the double-edged sword is the the heavy metals and stuff in seafood, which is a thing that freaks me out a lot. So I I try to with my omega-3 intake personally is the sardines, right? Because I think the smaller fish have less accumulation of uh, you know, toxicity as far as mercury and lead and those types of heavy metals. Um, and then when I'm not able to eat as much as that as I want, um I I do take an omega-3 with a high EPA, I was told was a little bit better for brain health. So as far as like the DHA EPA ratios, is having the EPA ratio higher. And then um just kind of lately I've actually been pushing that up to three to four grams, uh, just because my blood tests show that that's kind of where my optimal range lives for the lipids in in my blood uh when when I get my blood work done. Um so it does that does the I don't even know what the EPA DHA relation is. I just know that or I've been told I I don't know anything. I've just been told, or from what I read, the EPA is a lot better for your brain health. Uh do you know do you have any insight into why that is? Or or maybe what I've been reading is not great information.

Speaker 1 57:43

Um yeah, so uh, you know, well, first of all, the smaller fish thing. So so salmon actually has low um low mercury levels, which is good because it's one of the highest sources of omega-3s. Um the only thing I would worry about with sardines and like the little can anything in a can is that those cans have all kinds of um like uh things that can leach into your diet. So the microplastics and the forever chemicals and BPAs and stuff like that.

Speaker 58:13

Yeah.

Speaker 1 58:13

Even if it's BPA free, because a lot of cans are now, there's other there's other chemicals, PFAS and other things in those cans that sort of environmental problem that way. But you can track the mercury, right? So you can just track whether you're getting any of those heavy metals. I think that would maybe be a better way to go. Or eat the smaller fish in a jar if you can do that or fresh or somehow.

Polypharmacy And Smarter Supplement Use

Speaker 58:41

Um and with salmon, it it I I know like the wildcot is always way, you know, again, it's like it's like it's like, oh, there's farmed. Oh, it's called Atlantic now. And it's like, oh, is this farmed? Is this but like what's the stuff I see at Costco? Or is it just like, you know, or just when I go to my local supermarket, like, is this like I feel like with salmon, there's different like kind of levels as far as like the qualities of those, right? I would imagine farmed is least, but would you what would you would you say that farmed still has good ratios of omega-3? Or is it just is there a particular salmon to look after that would kind of encapsulate all these things as far as like, oh, Alaskan wild caught copper, whatever is the best, or maybe it's all great.

Speaker 1 59:25

Yeah. Um, so type of fish, yeah. I mean, I think in terms of wild caught versus farmed, it really depends where it's caught in the wild, right? Because are the oceans polluted where you're getting it? Um, so I think you really need to look into that. In that sense, farmed can be better, but then it depends on the conditions with which they're farming. So unfortunately, I think the answer is you have to look into each individual fissure that you're potentially consuming. Um and in terms of EHA, uh, so yeah, so the this the EPA and the DHA and function health has all of these ratios between them and you know how how much you're supposed to have one versus the other. In terms of what I know, the um the DHA is the one that is supposedly better for brain health. I haven't looked super high into this. That is the one that comes from seafood. The other one is more plant-based. So it'll come, EPA comes from um like flaxseed and walnuts and um uh seaweed, right? So um, so that one I guess is supposedly less good for your brain, but but honestly, I don't I don't know how much evidence there is behind that or really what I I probably need to write a substack on that topic in of itself.

Speaker 1:00:54

I'll read it.

Speaker 1 1:00:55

Yeah.

Speaker 1:00:58

Well, cool. Yeah, well, thanks. Thank thanks for that clarification because uh again, it's it's just so hard to separate fact from fiction, and then you know, these little blurbs come up, and even if I read like a great book on longevity and they'll talk about it, or you know, it's just like it's just like kind of hearing lots of voices talk about it and then just give some clarification of like, hey, this is you know the way to go with that. Because you're right about the sardines. I've it's so funny that I'm just like, well, I know smaller fish accumulate less toxins, but then it's like they're encapsulated in toxin, right? I mean they do come in the can that's like got the you know BPA free, but it's like what the different BPAs out there anyway. So yeah. So Dr. Glorious, so if someone's gonna be listening to this and they're gonna remember three things from this conversation today, what are the three main things that you think that they should come away with after our conversation?

Speaker 1 1:01:59

Brain aging is something that you can do something about. It's better to start early, um, because that's gonna allow you the best shot at prevention. Um, and I would say, you know, take the bull by the horns, be proactive. Um, just like other aspects of longevity. Um, you know, action is is king here.

Speaker 1:02:23

Got it. And then the last question, what is the most underrated habit that someone could take on today?

Speaker 1 1:02:31

The most underrated habit. Um underrated habit.

Speaker 1:02:36

Or maybe there's an overrated habit that looks like it's all the hype and doesn't deserve it.

Top Takeaways And Closing

Speaker 1 1:02:42

Um, I mean, there's so uh there's lots of so there's lots of good habits. Um I'm trying to think, you know, ones that are often underlooked, I would say, is, you know, morning sun. So that's one that um I try to recommend everybody get for better sleep. Um also community, so social isolation is a huge problem. So really people taking at least an hour of their day to get out and talk to people and be with loved ones or even meet new people. So that's one that's very underrated. And then um sleep and stress. Like I said, that's the executive phenotype. So if you're winning it, you also have to win at slowing down and doing less.

Speaker 1:03:27

Yeah, I I know uh Tim Ferris has a book supposedly about the the power of no or or something along those lines. It's like saying no more. And so I'm I'm like, oh, I'm looking forward to that book, you know, because I feel like those things are closely related, right? Like taking things off your plate is gonna often help with with stress there. So um, so thank you so much for spending your time and and going over all of this with us and and clearing up the thing on lithium for me um and and for our audience, you know. It's like if you hear this and you're just like, oh wow, like that is something you either never knew about, then you'll know if you do hear about it. And then if you're taking it now, it might be a good idea to not take that anymore. But again, I'm not a doctor. Consult with your doctor before doing anything here. And if this episode helped you, uh head to spanner.com, sp-a-n-n-r.com, join the newsletter, subscribe. If you like the episode, share it with someone you care about. If you have anyone in your life that you care about, this episode I can imagine really helped them because brain health is something we're all gonna be faced, we're all getting faced with aging, and it's something that's coming up. So if if this episode did you good, make sure to share it. So, with that, Dr. Glorioso, thank you so much for coming on today.

Speaker 1 1:04:48

Thank you, Brent. This was delightful.

Speaker 1:04:51

Awesome. Take care, everyone. This is the Longevity Loop Podcast.